Putnam lines - Ron Hix

[Hyper]

I am very new to doing track days and in an effort to try and learn everything I can I like watching the onboard videos. I also try and watch videos from riders that I know I can trust their abilities and techniques.

So I was watching a video at Putnam of Ron Hix from 2008. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jtmqL-mChzs

Ron (or others) I was curious about your line through #8 Dead Bear Turn. Out of several videos of advanced riders that I watched, it seemed that given a clear track you were the only one that would consistently take a line that resulted in a double apex. Obviously for you it was very fast but it was just unique from other riders. It also seems to my novice riding ability a hard line to do in the space of that turn, but you make it seem very smooth and flowing. Am I interpreting this wrong? Any advice?

Also I apologize if this has been asked before on here. I tried to search but didn't come up with anything.

 

[ronhix]

Hyper;132168 wrote: I am very new to doing track days and in an effort to try and learn everything I can I like watching the onboard videos. I also try and watch videos from riders that I know I can trust their abilities and techniques.

So I was watching a video at Putnam of Ron Hix from 2008. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jtmqL-mChzs

Ron (or others) I was curious about your line through #8 Dead Bear Turn. Out of several videos of advanced riders that I watched, it seemed that given a clear track you were the only one that would consistently take a line that resulted in a double apex. Obviously for you it was very fast but it was just unique from other riders. It also seems to my novice riding ability a hard line to do in the space of that turn, but you make it seem very smooth and flowing. Am I interpreting this wrong? Any advice?

Also I apologize if this has been asked before on here. I tried to search but didn't come up with anything.

Good question!

Dead bear always seems to be a "slower corner" for me at Putnam, so I just choose to get in there hot, turn the bike and then get a hard drive out of there. Basically, I try not to waste a lot of time in there. The front tire never seems to want to bite if I try to carry a lotta mid corner speed through there. Maybe it is because it is only one of two left handers and the left side of the front tire may not keep a lot of heat in it.

Just from a purely scientific point of view, if you want to increase corner speed then you must increase corner radius, SPEED = RADIUS. Basically, this approach would have you open up the entrances and use all the track on the exit. Using this formula, a mid-track entry + a carousel type mid corner + a late apex may be the threoretical fastest line through this corner.

But in real life, the front tire always wants to push on me if I go into dead bear with a lot of speed mid track, so I prefer the double apex approach with a focus on carrying good corner entry speed and getting the bike shut down and over on its ear and back up on the throttle quickly (the point and shoot method).

Hope that helps.

 

[TheGrouch]

Pffftt...yeah, that's the reason.

It's probably not that you like to get the bike stood up early on the exit so you can loft that cheater bike front wheel while passing 600s up the rise to T9 as if they are standing still cuz it makes your naughty bits tingly...

 

[ronhix]

TheGrouch;132431 wrote: Pffftt...yeah, that's the reason.

It's probably not that you like to get the bike stood up early on the exit so you can loft that cheater bike front wheel while passing 600s up the rise to T9 as if they are standing still cuz it makes your naughty bits tingly...

and there is always that...

 

[Hyper]

I don't know...I think I like Chris's explaination better!

Seriously though, thanks. I figured it was an effort to get in there and get out quick, but your detailed post helped me understand the how and why.

Looking forward to Putnam this weekend, especially now that I finally have a whole dry track day under my belt. The "Oh crap what I have I got myself into feeling!!" is gone. This weekend will be about being smooth, body position, working on lines, and just having fun.

See ya there!

 

[Trent1098S]

If you're just learning Putnam, try to hang with a CR or another rider that's close to your pace while you learn the track layout. Lots of turns there and a couple of blind spots, it takes a bit to get it down.

 

[dlockhart5x]

ronhix;132317 wrote: Good question!


Just from a purely scientific point of view, if you want to increase corner speed then you must increase corner radius, SPEED = RADIUS. Basically, this approach would have you open up the entrances and use all the track on the exit. Using this formula, a mid-track entry + a carousel type mid corner + a late apex may be the threoretical fastest line through this corner.

This is what I try to do with every corner, it comes with bike.
ya just gotta commit to max lean and your line from the entry and hope it all works out at the exit

it is really fun when it works and when it does not it is usually just a low side
Ps.
i'm not always good at it LOL

 

[Trent1098S]

dlockhart5x;132515 wrote:
it is really fun when it works and when it does not it is usually just a low side
Ps.
i'm not always good at it LOL

LMAO that's funny stuff man. So.. umm.. how many times you lowside before you got "sometimes" good at it?

 

[Hyper]

Trent1098S;132505 wrote: If you're just learning Putnam, try to hang with a CR or another rider that's close to your pace while you learn the track layout. Lots of turns there and a couple of blind spots, it takes a bit to get it down.

Thanks. I have done exactly one and half track days now and all of it has been at Putnam so I am beginning to get a feel for the track. My first day was with NESBA in the Intro class the first weekend in May. It rained pretty good the night before so the track was wet for the first session. While listening to the morning B group class we watched one guy go down in the Advanced class and then 2 in I. When we got out after a few good laps I watched a guy highside in turn 10 (pretty good video of it posted here). And while I fully intended to stay for the full weekend, after the second session I thought I could wait for a dryer day.

My second track day was with the local Ducati dealer at the end of May. No rain and HOT, but damn it was fun. A little loosely organized but I did have some Control Riders to follow me and I followed them to learn some lines. The biggest issue was that there were riders of every ability in the novice class. Some out for a Sunday ride and others really tearing it up.

And now 2 full, back to back, track days coming up this weekend!! Can't wait!!!

 

[dlockhart5x]

Trent1098S;132519 wrote: LMAO that's funny stuff man. So.. umm.. how many times you lowside before you got "sometimes" good at it?

30- ish?

to me, the essence of riding a motorcycle is leaning to turn,
and a friend explained riding 125 gp bikes as maximizing that essence