As a First Timer, Shim the rear? Or start stock?
- Thread starter Lean.In.
- Start date
HondaGalToo
Control Rider
I think the 190 Dunlops, unlike everyone else's 190s, are made for 600s? Are they a lot higher than 180/55s in another brand? I'd say just ride it. I rode my stock '07 gsxr 600 stock for the first year or so that I had it. All I did was had a suspension guy set the sag correctly. I've since had a Penske rear shock installed and a Penske 20mm kit in the forks. I had it done at Computrack, and they did the "sweet numbers" set up. He did make the forks flush with the triples, but I don't know how much was added to the rear. What I can say, is it's better, but not a HUGE difference.
Try it and see how it is...these bikes now are so good out of the box...
Try it and see how it is...these bikes now are so good out of the box...
I think some people may be misinterpreting my attitude abt this too. I'm new to this, yes, but I'm trying to learn as much as I can about it. It may sound wierd, but tuning the suspension is something I'm getting really pumped about playing with. What may sound like nervousness, or OCD, or worryin too much abt something isnt any of those...its me wanting to try every bit of it to see how each thing affects the bike and learn it well. The problem with that is that I AM new to track riding, so I may be getting myself in a little deep to start out when I should be concentrating on other things.
madriders86
New Member
This right here.
In order for you to notice the differences when you make a change you need to know your starting point to begin with. Recognizing those changes is also a skill in itself. I think it takes a good bit of experience to pick that sort of thing up. I damn sure don't have it yet lol.
sobottka
New Member
...i read it from by brain
i know you dont know me either but what im telling you (and others are telling you here) is correct and common learned knowledge in racing. you can find anything on the internet but what we are telling you we know through trial and error (more error in my case ....which is good cuz you learn).
greeny
Member
what rob is saying is that the shape of the tire is less important than the chassis' geometry changes going on. you're raising the rear when you use a bigger tire on the same sized wheel (i.e. 180 to 190) which equals quicker turn in that more than negates the "wider" profiled tire. now you wanna shim the rear even more?! in our experiences, which is not referring to stuff we've read on the internet but actual experiences, you want to compensate for a taller tire by removing shims.
arhale09
New Member
I've got my money on two things happening at your first track day:
1.You'll grin from ear to ear all day long;
2. Your suspension setup won't make a lick of difference in how your day turns out.
All this stuff is important if you want to win races in expert class, but not your first time out. I promise. Just enjoy your day
1.You'll grin from ear to ear all day long;
2. Your suspension setup won't make a lick of difference in how your day turns out.
All this stuff is important if you want to win races in expert class, but not your first time out. I promise. Just enjoy your day
some guy #2
Member
First trackday? Shimming the rear? Different tire sizes?
Just get your bike rideable (stock) and show up. The WERA board is as much heresay as this place.
At your pace it will not make a bit of difference what you do to the suspension or tires unless you are either really bad or really good.
Just get your bike rideable (stock) and show up. The WERA board is as much heresay as this place.
At your pace it will not make a bit of difference what you do to the suspension or tires unless you are either really bad or really good.
Hows this sound Sobottka? Because a 190 on the back actually raises the rear, you reduce your swingarm angle. Per someone that talked to an Ohlins rep, shimming the rear is needed to increase your swingarm angle again...so Ill admit, no problem, that I was just using separate information to come to a misguided conclusion....although the result is the same....logical though? whatcha think
(for everyone else, ill keep the shims out and start "stock" with my 190. But Id like to continue the discussion otherwise just for "learning" purposes...so ease up on the "you suck so its doesnt matter answers" haha)
(for everyone else, ill keep the shims out and start "stock" with my 190. But Id like to continue the discussion otherwise just for "learning" purposes...so ease up on the "you suck so its doesnt matter answers"
haha)Good read here...This is kind of a consolidation of all the stuff ive been reading into one thread. Pgs 2-3 it starts getting pretty good info wise (again, internet info). GoodMatt78 seems to have the best information:
http://www.gixxer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=238205
Again, turns out its not so much the tire, its getting the swingarm angle right....
http://www.gixxer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=238205
Again, turns out its not so much the tire, its getting the swingarm angle right....
Matt
New Member
I've haven't read the whole thread.. here's my $0.02.
to your last post, tires are the MOST important part of your setup. Then comes gearing, springs, geometry and damping. A perfect swing arm angle will do squat for you if the rear is spinning, old, sliding, under/over pressure. If you start chasing all sorts of setup stuff on crap tires, you'll be chasing issues that might go away with new (or even newer) tires.
to Lee's post, geometry can be a personal preference thing, most guys find that GSXRs do best on the track with more trail, so the front is generally raised (forks lower in the trees).
when my 08 gsxr 600 was running stock suspension, I liked it best with the fork caps flush with the top of the upper triple clamp and 6mm of shim on the shock. Rode GREAT!
I highly recommend you don't worry so much about getting the exact perfect geometry setup. A good baseline (flush forks / +2-4mm on shock) is a great place to start for an 06+ GSXR 600/750. Damping settings will vary depending on your pace, a good suspension guy at the track can help you get that near the target. Again, its your preference and area in which the bike will work just fine is quite large. The only way you'll learn how each change effects things is to try it out, BUT, for now since you're just getting started, just use a good baseline or whatever you're already comfortable and ride the damn thing all season.... Don't touch the geometry unless you have a problem that you know will be fixed by geometry changes.
Also, bikes have a wide range of settings that will work. Don't worry about having it exactly right.
Rob Sobottka is good with setup. He helped me diagnose a problem with old bike that was plaguing me for months!
to your last post, tires are the MOST important part of your setup. Then comes gearing, springs, geometry and damping. A perfect swing arm angle will do squat for you if the rear is spinning, old, sliding, under/over pressure. If you start chasing all sorts of setup stuff on crap tires, you'll be chasing issues that might go away with new (or even newer) tires.
to Lee's post, geometry can be a personal preference thing, most guys find that GSXRs do best on the track with more trail, so the front is generally raised (forks lower in the trees).
when my 08 gsxr 600 was running stock suspension, I liked it best with the fork caps flush with the top of the upper triple clamp and 6mm of shim on the shock. Rode GREAT!
I highly recommend you don't worry so much about getting the exact perfect geometry setup. A good baseline (flush forks / +2-4mm on shock) is a great place to start for an 06+ GSXR 600/750. Damping settings will vary depending on your pace, a good suspension guy at the track can help you get that near the target. Again, its your preference and area in which the bike will work just fine is quite large. The only way you'll learn how each change effects things is to try it out, BUT, for now since you're just getting started, just use a good baseline or whatever you're already comfortable and ride the damn thing all season.... Don't touch the geometry unless you have a problem that you know will be fixed by geometry changes.
Also, bikes have a wide range of settings that will work. Don't worry about having it exactly right.
Rob Sobottka is good with setup. He helped me diagnose a problem with old bike that was plaguing me for months!
