Need Help – What did I do wrong?

[SevenT6Vet]

steve gould;292467 wrote: Rob, Monday morning might have been the least traction I've ever had while riding VIR in over 10 years. Very small mistakes that would go unnoticed in good conditions resulted in crashes on Monday morning. It could have been a number of things but my guess would be cold tire.

I'm glad somebody else noticed this, I thought it was me. In my second session (I group...approx 10:25 a.m.), on the 2nd lap, i lost my front end in turn 10 for a split second. I use tire warmers, plus i was 1.5 laps into my session, so I didn't expect it at all. I'm confident my tires were warm. I was about a foot of the apex as I was trying to get around somebody and had to adjust my line prior to the turn, but i wasn't THAT far out where i would be in the debris.

Anyways, i've NEVER had my tire slip through that turn, i'm just glad it was only a little hiccup. I definitely checked up after that turn and took it easy until after lunch.

 

[meanstrk]

Still trying to figure out those round wheels.....

 

[meanstrk]

I'm glad somebody else noticed this, I thought it was me. In my second session (I group...approx 10:25 a.m.), on the 2nd lap, i lost my front end in turn 10 for a split second. I use tire warmers, plus i was 1.5 laps into my session, so I didn't expect it at all. I'm confident my tires were warm. I was about a foot of the apex as I was trying to get around somebody and had to adjust my line prior to the turn, but i wasn't THAT far out where i would be in the debris.

When it's that cold, you get about 1 decent lap before your tires LOSE heat, and then you are going to be fighting it. T-10 claimed a few bikes Monday. Four that I know of, and my son's was one of those. His front end tucked for no apparent reason, and everyone else said the exact same thing. It's usually not an action corner at all.

 

[SevenT6Vet]

meanstrk;292561 wrote: When it's that cold, you get about 1 decent lap before your tires LOSE heat, and then you are going to be fighting it. T-10 claimed a few bikes Monday. Four that I know of, and my son's was one of those. His front end tucked for no apparent reason, and everyone else said the exact same thing. It's usually not an action corner at all.

Maybe some coolant got dropped there then, perhaps the day before....? I certainly didn't see any oil spots. And I was going slow enough in the morning where I was looking for such spots.

And i've honestly only lost my front one other time that i can think of in the 6 years i've been doing this, and that was due to water bubbling up through a crack on the track, so it was perfectly explainable. But when the front end slid in T-10, it really rattled me.

Hope your son (and others) are OK.

 

[meanstrk]

Coolant is a possibility as well. With so many going down there, something was funky. The only times I have consistently lost the front was in cold temps like that at CMP. Got maybe two laps in and then the tires went off.

My son replaced a bar and was riding again the next session! Sore ass and shoulder, but good otherwise.

 

[steve gould]

SevenT6Vet;292570 wrote: Maybe some coolant got dropped there then, perhaps the day before....? I certainly didn't see any oil spots. And I was going slow enough in the morning where I was looking for such spots.

And i've honestly only lost my front one other time that i can think of in the 6 years i've been doing this, and that was due to water bubbling up through a crack on the track, so it was perfectly explainable. But when the front end slid in T-10, it really rattled me.

Hope your son (and others) are OK.

What I think happens in 10 is it drops off camber and unloads the front. A cold, less grippy track and crashes will result.

 

[Teh_K]

Rob,

When watching the video, I see a noticeable, but slight, change in lean angle (i.e. bar input) about 1/2 second before you lost it (2:31-2:32). And, about another 1/2 second before that, I see a noticeable, but slight, change in upper body position - both while already in mid-turn. Maybe you were adjusting to take a tighter line?

I think with these adjustments, you just simply out-rode your front tire, given the conditions.

I think this because I did the exact same thing in the exact same spot a few years ago, on the exact same front tire. At the time, it was a 3-year old OEM BT016 front that was strictly street-ridden, meaning the edges have never seen pavement and had become hard and brown. I don't know the history of your tire (and I think that fresh BT016's should be able to handle track riding), so this may not apply to you.

A lot of people put emphasis on rear tire grip, but the front is just as important. If your front tire is old, I'd consider getting a Q3 front to go w/ your rear. If your front is new/fresh, then... I dunno. In the 2nd-to-last session, the track was pretty warmed up. And, running low pressure builds up heat pretty quick, so I don't think it was a cold tire - maybe it overheated and got greasy?

Just my 0.02 cents - might be wrong

 

[Kruizen]

Robs tires were wearing nicely thru the day.

 

[Steverino]

My lone get off at VIR was in turn one. Throttle roll off mid corner due to slower riders in front of me (or poor judgement that I would not be able to catch up with them). Vtwins do not like throttle roll off mid corner...DAMHIK

 

[_Rob]

Thanks, everyone, for spending the time to help me with this. You’ve given me a few different things to follow up on to make improvements to me and my bike.

 

[vinny337]

Glad you’re ok! and yes, this sport is a continuous learning and improvement process...ask questions and enjoy the journey. See you out there next season!