NJMP - A little rant (and request for any gopro videos of the crash)

z064life

New Member
John,

I did get with the Director. The post was to get footage if there was some and just to generally bitch that the guy didn't even have the sense to say anything after the fact. I was bitching about the Rider, not NESBA

NJMP seems to be a track that attracks its share of idiot riders for whatever reason. I'm not sure NESBA can do much about it. I know I don't see the close passes, etc in near the quantity at any other track.
 

Pseudolus

Member
My observations as a relative noob. In my short, 16 track day career:

I've never seen the same rider be the constant offender. It seems to be several people in the group, and then they kind of fizzle out after the warnings at lunch and the day gets better.
I was passed on the inside one time. As I was shaking my head, I see a certain mid Atlantic director without a CR shirt, pull alongside the rider before he got to the next turn, and gave him the slash the throat sign. That day, I became confident that NESBA does all it can to protect us in an inherently dangerous sport. At the same time, 3 sessions later, that rider was being evaluated for a bump to A. I think this sport in some ways rewards a certain level of agression.
I can vouch for the fact that every person I've ever asked to ride with NESBA, has responded with "they have too many rules." As a result, I understand that we're trying to improve the club with this thread but NESBA has already established itself as the safest organization, and sometimes to the detriment of new sales/members, so we should give them plenty of credit (not saying anyone here isn't).

The advanced guys and gals contemplating quitting this sport really have me shook up. I woke up today, thinking about calling it quits because you must have seen things I haven't, and I'm not sure I'm comfortable with this risk (an ongoing challenge). But I do believe NESBA does almost all it can given the challenges with trying to mitigate risk in an inherently dangerous sport.

Also, I get what the folks are saying about perceptions of an event differing. This link shows my last session near lunch time on Sunday. When the rider passed me on the straight, I felt like it was a bit closer than necessary, but after reviewing it, it doesn't look bad. Unfortunately, he goes on to lose it a few turns later.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VPUnbUKLMTI

Lastly:

Dave561;290712 wrote: I do take a bit of offense to your response.
Seeing the old man write this is like seeing your dad cry. You're not neccessarily comfortable with it and you didn't know it was possible. :D

+2 to the paintball idea!
 

bmrboy

New Member
Being a NESBA member in the S. East region , I can honestly say when stupid stuff happens[and it does] that JRA and
his group , will find you , if you need to sit out a session , you WILL miss a session , if you continue ... Bye-Bye !!!!

I have personally seen JRA with-out a orange shirt patrolling & many of his CR's doing exactly the same .....
JRA runs a very tight ship , for that I'm very grateful ... I can remember 1 time at pit out after lunch , JRA,Calvin,Peanut
gave us all and a$$ chewing , this was a VIR North event that was just crazy , red flags were flying that day ......

JRA & a few of his guys were patrolling like sharks with blood in the water .... plenty were sat down that day !!!
Sunday was much , much better !! The squids went home .... It was a great day !!

As JRA & Calvin & Peanut says at the riders meeting ... Does everybody UNDERSTAND the rules !!!!!
 

ridelater

Member
Blueberry;290799 wrote: Sorry to hear of the incident and best wishes for a speedy recovery.

I'd very much encourage the use of technology to help drive the culture change we seek. The initial request was for camera footage to better understand the incident and identify whom was involved. If it was available these last 8 pages would likely be a very different dialogue. I personally always run a camera (or two), partially for learning, partially for fun footage, and partially for CYA in case of incidents. I know when something happens in front of me I also always approach the folks involved to let them know I have the footage if desired. The use of cameras is often discouraged due to distraction so I realize there are pros/cons, but for most folks I know with cameras the novelty factor wears off quickly and it typically becomes just another tool like lap timer, gear indicator, etc. Maybe it starts as an A-group initiative to run cameras to help police ourselves and drive safety awareness and see if it spreads from there?

Beyond on-board cameras, I'd also suggest Nesba and/or the track consider having on-track cameras rolling that may capture incidents or situations to provide data/feedback and most importantly visibility to what is actually occurring on track. If folks know that their actions are always visible (and they can be held accountable) I think it will drive compliance to the rules more. It won't fix everything but could provide some new tools to assist in enforcement. The CRs/staff do what they can to enforce the rules but that can only see/do so much.

If setup correctly you could also sell that footage to riders to pay for the equipment investment or perhaps contract it out to the photographers already there?

Think Russian dash-cams and speed/red-light cameras- applied technology!
the second part of this post was dead as soon as you wrote it. no track or track group would every allow this. The liability factor would go though the roof and open the door for lawsuit and then track day riding would be over. all you need to see is a track worker do something on film and a lawyer would link fault to it. A rider does do something stupid.....lawsuit, nesba makes a error.....lawsuit. then its just back to racing for all of us. shit all you need to do is find a loophole in some rule and two people would crash into them selves just so they could turn around and claim a lawsuit against the track.
 

motorkas

Member
bmrboy;290826 wrote: Being a NESBA member in the S. East region , I can honestly say when stupid stuff happens[and it does] that JRA and
his group , will find you , if you need to sit out a session , you WILL miss a session , if you continue ... Bye-Bye !!!!

I have personally seen JRA with-out a orange shirt patrolling & many of his CR's doing exactly the same .....
JRA runs a very tight ship , for that I'm very grateful ... I can remember 1 time at pit out after lunch , JRA,Calvin,Peanut
gave us all and a$$ chewing , this was a VIR North event that was just crazy , red flags were flying that day ......

JRA & a few of his guys were patrolling like sharks with blood in the water .... plenty were sat down that day !!!
Sunday was much , much better !! The squids went home .... It was a great day !!

As JRA & Calvin & Peanut says at the riders meeting ... Does everybody UNDERSTAND the rules !!!!!
Mike - honestly, it's just as tight of a ship up here, and just as honestly, I've heard Dave's riders meeting speech so many times, I almost have it memorized and at every riders meeting he does say "if something's going on, find one of us and tell us about it - if you tell us today we can do something about it, but if you wait until tomorrow on the boards there's nothing we can do".

I posted earlier that I had conversations with alot of CR's that day and every single one of them were pulling people left and right. Had a riders meeting called at lunch for I group (second time this year - other time was at NJMP Lightning) to calm things down and when one of the riders (whom I suspect was part of the problem) started bitching he instantly was set straight by the group of riders (to the point even his crew started turning on him).

When I was at NCBIKE two weeks ago - there was a big crash going into turn 1 (the rider who caused it posted video of it on Youtube - which I believe has since been taken down because it shows he clearly was at fault) but on the video you could hear him telling the workers "He didn't know what happened - the guy checked up and he ass packed him (at what looked like 100+ mph). His comment on his video that showed him ass packing someone at triple digits "when shit happens wipe your ass and get back up". Needless to say, I wasn't amused (and I have a twisted sense of humor). When I first read it, I thought "great sentiment to someone taking you out" - when I watched the video and realized he took the other person out (then continued to roll camera to get the damage of both bikes but never once walked over to apologize or ask how the other rider was doing - at least not on camera - I'm hoping he did off camera) I was like you got to be f'ing kidding me!?!?!?!?. The next session another red flag came out and Peanut lit into all of us while we were lined up. Interestingly enough - everyone was commenting on it being the largest turn out for NCBIKE yet.

Same with VIR north in June - Sat was "interesting" - Sun - "spectacular". . .Sat was also crazy packed and Sun was alot lighter.

I walk into a the riders meeting in the morning and see close to 150 riders ready to go, I already know what kind of day it's going to be: not a day for PR's, a day to spot and stay away from the really aggressive riders (if that means lining up in back on the right line - so be it. . .) a day to work on controlling my testosterone dump when somebody does what I think is a questionable pass and a day where I'm sitting out the first 2-3 sessions because there are going to be ALOT of crashes and I know by the last two sessions of the day - everybody's going to be done and its clear track (since I typically ride 5-6 sessions - not missing any track time by sitting out the first couple). I also say a healthy amount of prayers because I know my odds just went up for something out of my control taking me out because with more riders, more variables, higher chances. . . - I also try to use it to work on skills - passing (cleanly) usually with that many riders, you have limited opportunites to pass so its great to work on find the passing zones and work on multi bike clean passes and anything else that would require me to slow down since I'll be off pace anyway.

Believe me - probably more scary than being out on track while the shenanigans are happening is being in the pits while your friends or loved ones are out on the track and red flag goes up and waiting to see if you see their helmet roll into pit lane. those are usually the longest 2 minutes of my life. For selfish reasons, I want everybody to get through EVERY SESSION cleanly - but when there's obvious signs that the day is "going to interesting" my mind set instantly changes - and so does my riding and my focus for the day.

Just as interesting - the best, cleanest day I've ever been a part of started out with the normal questions being asked "how many are new to the track" - no hand went up; "how many are new to NESBA" - no hands went up, about 20 riders per group - I know there were no red flags in any group that day, and I believe no crashes. . .it was at NJMP thunderbolt this summer. . .I think a thread was started about it, maybe got to two or three pages.
 

mike574

Member
Dave561;290777 wrote: Ok, new rules in place as of today.

Rider's meeting is promptly as 8:15 AM. We will lock the garage immediately at 8:15AM. All those that are not in the tech garage will be hunted down by the CR's in the pits and have their armbands removed. To ensure that we don't miss one we will use a visual queue of removing the offending riders arms. Now I realize we may get a few guests in the process, but small price to pay

All offending riders of any rules throughout the days will be shot with a paintball gun on track. If they do not crash upon impact, we will allow them to continue. If they crash problem solved. If not then the remaining riders will easily be able to identify them.

At any point in time a CR can smack an offending rider up the back side of their head. If they even glance up the inside of a rider we will tag them. Better safe than sorry.

Any rider with more than two paint ball strikes will be hung from the observation tower at lunch. This will provide a deterrent to any additional riders that may feel the need to break a rule. Any riders caught after lunch will be burned at the stake. This provides light and a great place to make smores. Everyone loves smores.

Thank you, Dave
Awsome, my goal in life is no longer to be a coach one day, I want to be the guy who shoots people with the paint ball gun. I could sit on the flagers booth on the straight. In stead of a meatball flag just peg offending riders
 

Unbroken13

Member
NJMP - A little rant (and request for any gopro videos of the crash)

+10000 to motorkas
I've learned to adjust how I ride to how the day looks... At ncbike I slowed down a lot when around other riders and didn't take a lot of passing opportunities just because of how the day was going

I'm a newbie for sure... 7 track days ... I know of one inside pass I did on someone... I ran in to hot and they drove in deeper than I thought they would... Completely my mistake... I walked 3 laps through the pits looking for the guy and couldn't find him to save my life.. The problem was I'm new and riding at speed is my hole focus... Noticing the color of someone's bike or leathers was a little beyond what my mind could process... Then of course after it happened I noticed everyone's bike and color which only added to the confusion... Like I said I was real new... I guess what I'm saying is that sometimes we screw up and don't get to square it with someone... But there are also asshole that don't give a shit...

One more point... Sometimes these threads are like a different group of people and so opposite of what I see at the track... The nesba I see at the track is almost like family... But sometimes this forum seems totally different...
Just saying
 

JRA

New Member
z064life;290812 wrote: John,

I did get with the Director. The post was to get footage if there was some and just to generally bitch that the guy didn't even have the sense to say anything after the fact. I was bitching about the Rider, not NESBA

NJMP seems to be a track that attracks its share of idiot riders for whatever reason. I'm not sure NESBA can do much about it. I know I don't see the close passes, etc in near the quantity at any other track.

Chris, My post wasn't directed at you, just at the tone of this thread in general.

One more point... Sometimes these threads are like a different group of people and so opposite of what I see at the track... The nesba I see at the track is almost like family... But sometimes this forum seems totally different...
Just saying
I believe that's because probably 95% of the people who make up the club aren't on the message board, and also because it's easier to say what you really think on the message board than it is in person.
 

bmrboy

New Member
motorkas;290831 wrote: Mike - honestly, it's just as tight of a ship up here, and just as honestly, I've heard Dave's riders meeting speech so many times, I almost have it memorized and at every riders meeting he does say "if something's going on, find one of us and tell us about it - if you tell us today we can do something about it, but if you wait until tomorrow on the boards there's nothing we can do".

I posted earlier that I had conversations with alot of CR's that day and every single one of them were pulling people left and right. Had a riders meeting called at lunch for I group (second time this year - other time was at NJMP Lightning) to calm things down and when one of the riders (whom I suspect was part of the problem) started bitching he instantly was set straight by the group of riders (to the point even his crew started turning on him).

When I was at NCBIKE two weeks ago - there was a big crash going into turn 1 (the rider who caused it posted video of it on Youtube - which I believe has since been taken down because it shows he clearly was at fault) but on the video you could hear him telling the workers "He didn't know what happened - the guy checked up and he ass packed him (at what looked like 100+ mph). His comment on his video that showed him ass packing someone at triple digits "when shit happens wipe your ass and get back up". Needless to say, I wasn't amused (and I have a twisted sense of humor). When I first read it, I thought "great sentiment to someone taking you out" - when I watched the video and realized he took the other person out (then continued to roll camera to get the damage of both bikes but never once walked over to apologize or ask how the other rider was doing - at least not on camera - I'm hoping he did off camera) I was like you got to be f'ing kidding me!?!?!?!?. The next session another red flag came out and Peanut lit into all of us while we were lined up. Interestingly enough - everyone was commenting on it being the largest turn out for NCBIKE yet.

Same with VIR north in June - Sat was "interesting" - Sun - "spectacular". . .Sat was also crazy packed and Sun was alot lighter.

I walk into a the riders meeting in the morning and see close to 150 riders ready to go, I already know what kind of day it's going to be: not a day for PR's, a day to spot and stay away from the really aggressive riders (if that means lining up in back on the right line - so be it. . .) a day to work on controlling my testosterone dump when somebody does what I think is a questionable pass and a day where I'm sitting out the first 2-3 sessions because there are going to be ALOT of crashes and I know by the last two sessions of the day - everybody's going to be done and its clear track (since I typically ride 5-6 sessions - not missing any track time by sitting out the first couple). I also say a healthy amount of prayers because I know my odds just went up for something out of my control taking me out because with more riders, more variables, higher chances. . . - I also try to use it to work on skills - passing (cleanly) usually with that many riders, you have limited opportunites to pass so its great to work on find the passing zones and work on multi bike clean passes and anything else that would require me to slow down since I'll be off pace anyway.

Believe me - probably more scary than being out on track while the shenanigans are happening is being in the pits while your friends or loved ones are out on the track and red flag goes up and waiting to see if you see their helmet roll into pit lane. those are usually the longest 2 minutes of my life. For selfish reasons, I want everybody to get through EVERY SESSION cleanly - but when there's obvious signs that the day is "going to interesting" my mind set instantly changes - and so does my riding and my focus for the day.
br />Just as interesting - the best, cleanest day I've ever been a part of started out with the normal questions being asked "how many are new to the track" - no hand went up; "how many are new to NESBA" - no hands went up, about 20 riders per group - I know there were no red flags in any group that day, and I believe no crashes. . .it was at NJMP thunderbolt this summer. . .I think a thread was started about it, maybe got to two or three pages.

Yes , My Friend .. You don't have to be a rocket scientist to figure out what kind of day it might be .... Take a good look around
you can clearly see that trouble is brewing ... It would not be the first time I've sat out the first few sessions .....
I just wait till the dust settles , be the last rider out , give myself plenty of space , and ride my ride ...

I've been riding long enough to spot trouble [squids] I would much rather ride up from behind see what I need to see make quick
work of them and continue to move up through the pack , once I've past them , they're NOT going to catch me , I'll make sure
of that !! As I've said in many of my posts , we're not playing Golf , there are no do overs here , poor judgment can have well ,
catastrophic endings .... We must all do our part in keeping this sport as safe as possible ... if you see something not good
bring it to the attention of your CR's or Director ... all though there will always be FOOLS !!! But if we keep weeding them out
maybe they will do something else like , basket weaving ..... :D
 

CBRtist

Well-Known Member
!

z064life;290812 wrote: I was bitching about the Rider, not NESBA.
Some of us, myself included, might have turned this thread into a podium for our personal agendas. We all have things we think that can be done better. There are good (veteran) people in this thread making good points. Just realize... whoever was tweaked... it IS coming from a good place. I think we can all agree on one thing: We want to make the Club a better place, we just can't agree on HOW.

I will say, I've noticed an influx of mean-spirited people in the MA. Whether it is the aggressive rider or those who have members frightened to post in fear of retaliation, the meanness is there period. The Meanies... whether it's the location, lack of sleep, race mentality, egos... are getting tougher to police and correct. The worst part is that some of these offenders can only be flushed out AFTER something terrible has happened.

I'm one to give credit where credit is due. I know how hard the directors/CRs work and the personal sacrifices they make. I've noticed improvements, I've noticed that grumblings are being heard, and I don't want them to think that it goes unnoticed. A little positive reinforcement can go a long way. I also have all the confidence that they will continue to improve incrementally from here on out.

I'm certain that Directors, CRs and members alike ALL want a safe environment in which to ride. Just as much as we don't want to be hurt by an irresponsible rider, THEY don't want to get hurt by one either. If you think they don't care, all you had to see was Dave's face and apology after he made me crash. Ok, that's not how it technically went down... ok I really made myself crash :poorguy:

Here's the broken record again.... I still propose that we form (and I'm working on this), member-based volunteer committees and that will give us the power to change things where we can instead of bum rushing directors/CRs with multiple issues on this forum (which is never received well). It is going to alleviate a lot of pressures and frustrations within the Club, and allow admin to focus on internal issues. For example a committee could brainstorm a program or way to bring safer, more responsible riders to the Club and then we can direct the other ones to XYZ Club ;)

I really hope between admin hearing us and us joining together as members we will really make a huge difference in 2014! I would hate to see some great, core members leave for good because of their continual disappointments. :(
 

R1Baby

Control Rider
Dave561;290777 wrote: Ok, new rules in place as of today.

Rider's meeting is promptly as 8:15 AM. We will lock the garage immediately at 8:15AM. All those that are not in the tech garage will be hunted down by the CR's in the pits and have their armbands removed. To ensure that we don't miss one we will use a visual queue of removing the offending riders arms. Now I realize we may get a few guests in the process, but small price to pay

All offending riders of any rules throughout the days will be shot with a paintball gun on track. If they do not crash upon impact, we will allow them to continue. If they crash problem solved. If not then the remaining riders will easily be able to identify them.

At any point in time a CR can smack an offending rider up the back side of their head. If they even glance up the inside of a rider we will tag them. Better safe than sorry.

Any rider with more than two paint ball strikes will be hung from the observation tower at lunch. This will provide a deterrent to any additional riders that may feel the need to break a rule. Any riders caught after lunch will be burned at the stake. This provides light and a great place to make smores. Everyone loves smores.

Thank you, Dave
Wow, now I have to get a paintball gun, or will one be provided at the staff meeting? CR can smack offending riders, got it!
 
Ballpeen;290790 wrote: Dan, NO waggons here... please see my prior post. I think what frustrates ME... Is that I saw Judy, I saw some of the folks on this thread on Sunday and NOTHING was said about any of this. One gentleman came up to me and asked me to look at "a guy on a 250 who had bumped a rider" ... we all know there are 2 sides... So i spent the next 2 sessions with and without a shirt...up on and backed off this rider...found there were 2 other 250s that day and i saw no deplorable riding... My point.... I believe during the riders meeting it is mentioned "that if your seeing something or not having fun please come see us vise jumping on the boards and ranting". That said... I was once new and i accept and understand the frustrations voiced here..my only hope is that my point is taken by all who read this...We xcant be everywhere..BUT your eyes CAN be..help us make it better... Regarding BN... i havent seen him this year unless i missed him?

Take care and I hope to see you out there..helping us make this a better club...

ps: i am a fan of the paintball idea...

Sent from my SCH-I510 using Tapatalk 2
Len:

Two of the riders are close friends of mine and the other is an acquaintance. Oh, and they are on 125's not 250's :D

Actually, I think the complaint you got was legit as my two friends bumped down from A to I group for a couple reasons and the one, when giving me a ride report, said riding in A back to I took a little adjustment and someone was passed in the inside.

He made corrections and changed up his riding style. I can say if he had gotten yanked and told to sit out for the mistake he would not have bitched or back talked. As for talking with the director for the day. I would, but I have had very few problems so I have only had to approach a couple times.

Oh, my buddies had an awesome day too and I wish a 4th 125 was their in I that day!

I appreciate the discussion :)

BZ
 
vinny337;290715 wrote: Hmmmm, BZ I'm somewhat surprised in your comments....Please let's not forget and I'll leave it at that.
Vin:

I have not forgot and but their is a difference in an honest mistake and an egotistical mistake. Had I been made to sit out a session for that pass I made during that Absolute track day. I would have graciously accepted my fate my man.

I am not above reproach and hold myself in the same judgement as I do others.

I have had honest mistakes happen to me, one was CLOSE! And me and that rider still chat and laugh it up when we see each other in the pits. I knew he wasn't trying to be an asshole...and that makes the difference :cool:

BZ
 

RADAR Magnet

New Member
motorkas;290831 wrote: Mike - honestly, it's just as tight of a ship up here, and just as honestly, I've heard Dave's riders meeting speech so many times, I almost have it memorized and at every riders meeting he does say "if something's going on, find one of us and tell us about it - if you tell us today we can do something about it, but if you wait until tomorrow on the boards there's nothing we can do".

I posted earlier that I had conversations with alot of CR's that day and every single one of them were pulling people left and right. Had a riders meeting called at lunch for I group (second time this year - other time was at NJMP Lightning) to calm things down and when one of the riders (whom I suspect was part of the problem) started bitching he instantly was set straight by the group of riders (to the point even his crew started turning on him).
I know I saw Dave cruising through the I group in plain clothes more than once and was at the lunchtime meeting when the CRs told everyone to pull their heads out of their asses. Crashing out due to someone else's mistake/bad judgment must surely suck, and venting about it is understandable, but the direction this thread has taken would leave a newcomer with the impression that it's the wild west out there and that's not the way I see it (except for dealer days).

I'm all for vigilance in enforcing the rules and promoting a safe environment but I also think it's helpful to remember Mike Moore's admonition that this isn't golf; mistakes are going to happen despite everyone's best efforts. But OP does have a point that those mistakes should be owned up to; sucks that this one wasn't.
 

motorkas

Member
bmrboy;290844 wrote: Yes , My Friend .. You don't have to be a rocket scientist to figure out what kind of day it might be .... Take a good look around
you can clearly see that trouble is brewing ... It would not be the first time I've sat out the first few sessions .....
I just wait till the dust settles , be the last rider out , give myself plenty of space , and ride my ride ...

I've been riding long enough to spot trouble [squids] I would much rather ride up from behind see what I need to see make quick
work of them and continue to move up through the pack , once I've past them , they're NOT going to catch me , I'll make sure
of that !! As I've said in many of my posts , we're not playing Golf , there are no do overs here , poor judgment can have well ,
catastrophic endings .... We must all do our part in keeping this sport as safe as possible ... if you see something not good
bring it to the attention of your CR's or Director ... all though there will always be FOOLS !!! But if we keep weeding them out
maybe they will do something else like , basket weaving ..... :D
Couldn't have said it any better. It's those days I'm thankful for my gray hairs. . .sometimes they actually are an advantage. . .:D

Read something on another board a while back which made me smile:

"On the street, we practice learning how to add lean angle. On the track, we practice learning how not to add lean angle." :wow:

Sometimes people just don't get the memo. . .;)
 

bmrboy

New Member
motorkas;290868 wrote: Couldn't have said it any better. It's those days I'm thankful for my gray hairs. . .sometimes they actually are an advantage. . .:D;)
Don't start talking about gray hair .... I think mine is turning white !!! :eek:
 

denbsteph

Member
motorkas;290831 wrote: Mike - honestly, it's just as tight of a ship up here, and just as honestly, I've heard Dave's riders meeting speech so many times, I almost have it memorized and at every riders meeting he does say "if something's going on, find one of us and tell us about it - if you tell us today we can do something about it, but if you wait until tomorrow on the boards there's nothing we can do".

I posted earlier that I had conversations with alot of CR's that day and every single one of them were pulling people left and right. Had a riders meeting called at lunch for I group (second time this year - other time was at NJMP Lightning) to calm things down and when one of the riders (whom I suspect was part of the problem) started bitching he instantly was set straight by the group of riders (to the point even his crew started turning on him).

When I was at NCBIKE two weeks ago - there was a big crash going into turn 1 (the rider who caused it posted video of it on Youtube - which I believe has since been taken down because it shows he clearly was at fault) but on the video you could hear him telling the workers "He didn't know what happened - the guy checked up and he ass packed him (at what looked like 100+ mph). His comment on his video that showed him ass packing someone at triple digits "when shit happens wipe your ass and get back up". Needless to say, I wasn't amused (and I have a twisted sense of humor). When I first read it, I thought "great sentiment to someone taking you out" - when I watched the video and realized he took the other person out (then continued to roll camera to get the damage of both bikes but never once walked over to apologize or ask how the other rider was doing - at least not on camera - I'm hoping he did off camera) I was like you got to be f'ing kidding me!?!?!?!?. The next session another red flag came out and Peanut lit into all of us while we were lined up. Interestingly enough - everyone was commenting on it being the largest turn out for NCBIKE yet.

Same with VIR north in June - Sat was "interesting" - Sun - "spectacular". . .Sat was also crazy packed and Sun was alot lighter.

I walk into a the riders meeting in the morning and see close to 150 riders ready to go, I already know what kind of day it's going to be: not a day for PR's, a day to spot and stay away from the really aggressive riders (if that means lining up in back on the right line - so be it. . .) a day to work on controlling my testosterone dump when somebody does what I think is a questionable pass and a day where I'm sitting out the first 2-3 sessions because there are going to be ALOT of crashes and I know by the last two sessions of the day - everybody's going to be done and its clear track (since I typically ride 5-6 sessions - not missing any track time by sitting out the first couple). I also say a healthy amount of prayers because I know my odds just went up for something out of my control taking me out because with more riders, more variables, higher chances. . . - I also try to use it to work on skills - passing (cleanly) usually with that many riders, you have limited opportunites to pass so its great to work on find the passing zones and work on multi bike clean passes and anything else that would require me to slow down since I'll be off pace anyway.

Believe me - probably more scary than being out on track while the shenanigans are happening is being in the pits while your friends or loved ones are out on the track and red flag goes up and waiting to see if you see their helmet roll into pit lane. those are usually the longest 2 minutes of my life. For selfish reasons, I want everybody to get through EVERY SESSION cleanly - but when there's obvious signs that the day is "going to interesting" my mind set instantly changes - and so does my riding and my focus for the day.
br />Just as interesting - the best, cleanest day I've ever been a part of started out with the normal questions being asked "how many are new to the track" - no hand went up; "how many are new to NESBA" - no hands went up, about 20 riders per group - I know there were no red flags in any group that day, and I believe no crashes. . .it was at NJMP thunderbolt this summer. . .I think a thread was started about it, maybe got to two or three pages.

Talk about hitting the nail on the head!!! Here is someone who PAYS attention in the riders meeting, being CONSCIOUS of what is going on around him. I do the same exact thing, I'm gonna hang out in the back of the group and STUDY those ind's that I have not seen before/or lots of riders out there, I'm gonna hang out a session or two. As much as my inside motor wants to go out, I have to check myself. CONSISTENCY is why I ride with NESBA. It sounds like it is the same riders meeting that is happening 10 hrs away. :adore: :adore:
 

denbsteph

Member
bmrboy;290826 wrote: Being a NESBA member in the S. East region , I can honestly say when stupid stuff happens[and it does] that JRA and
his group , will find you , if you need to sit out a session , you WILL miss a session , if you continue ... Bye-Bye !!!!

I have personally seen JRA with-out a orange shirt patrolling & many of his CR's doing exactly the same .....
JRA runs a very tight ship , for that I'm very grateful ... I can remember 1 time at pit out after lunch , JRA,Calvin,Peanut
gave us all and a$$ chewing , this was a VIR North event that was just crazy , red flags were flying that day ......

JRA & a few of his guys were patrolling like sharks with blood in the water .... plenty were sat down that day !!!
Sunday was much , much better !! The squids went home .... It was a great day !!

As JRA & Calvin & Peanut says at the riders meeting ... Does everybody UNDERSTAND the rules !!!!!
BMRBOY has hit the nail on the head as well, I have seen this as well. At times I think it needs to be enforced with a little more authority. I have had my arss handed to me several times for stupid stuff, I'm far from being that exceptional rider and having a CR or Directors pull you up and give you a peace of advice will get your attention. It's a TD, not a race. If you want to trade paint and do silly stuff............go join the squids on the street. I'm sure they will be more than ready to welcome you into their band of misfits. :)
 

JRA

New Member
At times I think it needs to be enforced with a little more authority.
I have had my arss handed to me several times for stupid stuff,
Dennis I'd just like to be clear. Are you saying I should have booted you from the event when you did something stupid? Would that be authoritative enough? I'm taking notes here because it's not uncommon for that to happen to people. If you are suggesting that that penalty should be used more often for lesser offenses, or even at a rider's first rule violation then I'm all ears. In the past I've been willing to give everyone a second chance to straighten out unless they made contact with another rider. I think that's a fair way to handle it. One second chance and that's it.

Look, everybody is an expert when they are sitting behind the keyboard second guessing how an event went. Between the staff at every NESBA trackday you have the experience that combined might amount to running 1000+ track days. I've been around a long time, and so have many others, and there is very little that we haven't seen 10X over. You handle some situations outwardly for everyone to see, and you handle others where no one notices, and the latter is always preferable. We use our best judgement. Sometimes people agree with that judgement, and sometimes they disagree, but always that judgement is based on years of running trackdays. We have experience to draw from. Almost always that experience leads to the correct decision being made, and when it doesn't we learn from that so the next time we have that knowledge to draw from. We do the best we can and in the end either you either trust that we provide a safe and fun event or you don't.
 
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