Tire warmers.....

[vanelli56]

Well, I have been going back and forth in my mind about getting a set of tire warmers. I understand their benefits as far as reducing heat cycles, and not having to worry about a cold tire crash.....BUT

I just wanted to get some insight from you guys on your thoughts....
Are they really worth it??? I know they are an investment, but they are kind of steep in prices. And for a guy like me that might get 5 track days in a year.... just not sure if its worth the investment.

Normally I only use a rear tire for two track days at the most anyway, then wear it out the rest of the way commuting back and forth to school/work during the summer. So the tire is going to get heat cycled anyway. So that is not a concern.....

That leaves the cold tire crash.... Considering the quality of tires out there now, and that I usually take at least one or two good warm up laps to get to speed.... not sure that warmers would benefit anyway.

Just wanted to see how many of you have them, use them, swear by them, dont think people should ride with out them, dont care, think they are a mute item to have, etc, etc. etc......
Post up what ever your thoughts are.:notsure:

Thanks,
Gene-o-vanelli

 

[Sklossmonster]

In my opinion race tires need tire warmers, period. Lots of people don't think they need tire warmers if they're not racing, to me that's like saying I don't need my seatbelt on if I'm not on the highway.

If you don't want to run warmers, there are plenty of good hybrid tires that work well on the street and on the track, they don't heat cycle and they don't need warmers.

That's my two cents, anyway. Good luck with whatever you decide.

 

[jimgl3]

speaking of which... get them 003RS going for us! LOL!

 

[Teamck16]

I just got an ok used pair for $168. I was in the same exact boat ur in right now. What got me was worrying about crashing the first few laps out on cold tires as well as getting ran over the first few laps by guys that had them, and would knee drag coming out of pit road. I almost had a very bad accident because I was in I group at Jennings Gp and everybody in that group seemed to have them. They were flying from the get go and my buddy and I were crusing, trying to let our tires heat up. I was almost cliped by a bike that was going at least 30 mph faster than I was. I havent used them yet, but will at RA this coming week- cant wait to drag the knee right from the start!!!

 

[Bluenvy]

its nice being able to go wide open right off the get go and not waste 2 or so laps getting your tires up to temp. even longer on real cold days.
down at CMP it was like maybe 40 degrees when we rolled on the track in the morning, i had a new tire on the back. i had my warmers on and i was WFO from the get go. no slippage or cold tear at all.
i would just pick up a used set for cheap but only if you use race tires like sklossmonster was talking about

 

[snikwad]

i scored a used set of CH standards for $150, if youre buying new then i can see your concern, but a used set can make your tires last a lot longer, especially if like me youre running takeoff track/race tires, and as the guys said, WOT right away.

If you look hard enough you can score a nice used set for $200 or under.

 

[ERB68]

I had a set of Pilot Powers let me down. Literally I low sided cause my pace had out grow the PP. So DOT race tires here I come. I guess I could have gone with dual compound tires(Ie; DC III or PP2CT) but the cost was very similar. So I went looking for a deal on warmers. Last winter I found a set of Suzuka dual temps though NESBA for $275 I think. I only used them once, very nice.

Now, If I could just get my confidence back from the low side.:banghead:

 

[rcr14]

I bought mine when i raced. that said. if you love pushing from the first lap maybe you should. Also, consider what tracks you go too. Some don't have power,so then your begging to hook up to somebody's generator. And if you can't whats the point. Street bais tires don't need and probably should'nt be warmed.

 

[dogger]

When I ran without warmers I was always asking myself... I wonder if my tires are warm yet. Not having to ask that question, or worry about finding out, was worth $200.

 

[Poper]

dogger;44988 wrote: When I ran without warmers I was always asking myself... I wonder if my tires are warm yet. Not having to ask that question, or worry about finding out, was worth $200.

I'm looking forward to that same confidence. I crashed three times last year, all in the first session of the day, within the first three laps. Was it rider error? Yes, but hot tires would have helped a little in saving my screw-ups. The idea of knowing that my tires are hot is going to give me confidence right out of pit road. I picked up a set of duel-tepm Suzukas from Moon at NESBA and I am very happy with their initial quality and construction. Good luck with whichever route you decide.

 

[BrianR6]

Poper;45063 wrote: I'm looking forward to that same confidence. I crashed three times last year, all in the first session of the day, within the first three laps. Was it rider error? Yes, but hot tires would have helped a little in saving my screw-ups. The idea of knowing that my tires are hot is going to give me confidence right out of pit road. I picked up a set of duel-tepm Suzukas from Moon at NESBA and I am very happy with their initial quality and construction. Good luck with whichever route you decide.

not only do your tires need to warm up (if not using warmers).. your mind and body also need to warm up. So even if you do use warmers, you need to gradually get up to speed.

 

[Poper]

BrianR6;45064 wrote: not only do your tires need to warm up (if not using warmers).. your mind and body also need to warm up. So even if you do use warmers, you need to gradually get up to speed.

I do agree, and WOT on the first bend is never a good idea for a trackday rider. But, having the "Are the tires warm?" box checked off when rolling out on track is nothing but confidence inspiring, freeing up more concentration to focus on warming the body up, coming up to pace, and riding the line.

 

[PJZOCC624]

If you're running race tires (SC pros, Power race), they're probably a good idea. Slicks = yes, you definitely should. Helping with the heat cycles is a solid reason for using them.

Now, I'm not sold on the whole confidence-inspired notion about warmers. (No offense, Poper) I feel like they almost give a false sense of security, especially on cold or cooler days. A cold track, cold wheels will suck the heat out of any tire, whether they're on warmers or not. I personally like the lap or two to let my tires get up to temp, as well as find my lines, my turn-in points, etc (I use it like a sighting lap). On the warmer days of summer, the time for tire to get up to temp decreases. (I run Power race med front, 2CT rear - and after the first lap at Beave it's giddyup and go!) That said, I have never gotten into a situation where I said to myself "Man, if I had tire warmers, I wouldn't have wasted 14 laps today" or "If I had warmers I wouldn't worry about low-siding in turn X". I've also yet to outride a tire to the point where I had to go to full race tires and warmers because the PPs just weren't cutting it. I'm a mid-pack "I" guy, and it sure as hell ain't the tires or lack or warmers that's keeping me from going faster, or my confidence from climbing. Frankly, I could probably throw on the street Pilot Powers and not worry about it. I might have to pay more attention to what the tires/bike are telling me in terms of feedback and grip, but I doubt if I'd lose any time off my lap average. (These comments exclude the REALLY fast guys - "A" guys, racers, etc).

Its an interesting discussion, and comes up many times each year. I've just never wanted to feel like I had to upgrade tires/warmers to go faster. Hell, I went from a liter-bike to a 600 last year and I went faster on the 6 than on the 1K. My basic point is, I have to have confidence in what I am doing on the bike and what my abilities are. No set of tires or tire warmers are ever going to overcompensate for my lack self-trust or ability.

Here endeth the rant.

 

[PJZOCC624]

Anyone selling a used set of warmers? I'm in the market...

 

[ERB68]

PJZOCC17;45072 wrote: Anyone selling a used set of warmers? I'm in the market...

I would check here http://forums.13x.com/showthread.php?t=210714

 

[Poper]

PJZOCC17;45071 wrote: If you're running race tires (SC pros, Power race), they're probably a good idea. Slicks = yes, you definitely should. Helping with the heat cycles is a solid reason for using them.

Now, I'm not sold on the whole confidence-inspired notion about warmers. (No offense, Poper) I feel like they almost give a false sense of security, especially on cold or cooler days. A cold track, cold wheels will suck the heat out of any tire, whether they're on warmers or not. I personally like the lap or two to let my tires get up to temp, as well as find my lines, my turn-in points, etc (I use it like a sighting lap). On the warmer days of summer, the time for tire to get up to temp decreases. (I run Power race med front, 2CT rear - and after the first lap at Beave it's giddyup and go!) That said, I have never gotten into a situation where I said to myself "Man, if I had tire warmers, I wouldn't have wasted 14 laps today" or "If I had warmers I wouldn't worry about low-siding in turn X". I've also yet to outride a tire to the point where I had to go to full race tires and warmers because the PPs just weren't cutting it. I'm a mid-pack "I" guy, and it sure as hell ain't the tires or lack or warmers that's keeping me from going faster, or my confidence from climbing. Frankly, I could probably throw on the street Pilot Powers and not worry about it. I might have to pay more attention to what the tires/bike are telling me in terms of feedback and grip, but I doubt if I'd lose any time off my lap average. (These comments exclude the REALLY fast guys - "A" guys, racers, etc).

Its an interesting discussion, and comes up many times each year. I've just never wanted to feel like I had to upgrade tires/warmers to go faster. Hell, I went from a liter-bike to a 600 last year and I went faster on the 6 than on the 1K. My basic point is, I have to have confidence in what I am doing on the bike and what my abilities are. No set of tires or tire warmers are ever going to overcompensate for my lack self-trust or ability.

Here endeth the rant.

Don't you ever disagree with me again.

You do have a sound argument, but I think it might just come down to a personal preference/confidence decision. All of this theory could go out the window after using warmers for the first time this season, but for myself, I am looking forward to at least having a head start on getting the tires up to temp on cool days and having them ready-to-go on hot days.

Have any pics taken of the hauler now assembled and ready to go?

 

[snikwad]

PJZOCC17;45071 wrote: If you're running race tires (SC pros, Power race), they're probably a good idea. Slicks = yes, you definitely should. Helping with the heat cycles is a solid reason for using them.

Now, I'm not sold on the whole confidence-inspired notion about warmers. (No offense, Poper) I feel like they almost give a false sense of security, especially on cold or cooler days. A cold track, cold wheels will suck the heat out of any tire, whether they're on warmers or not. I personally like the lap or two to let my tires get up to temp, as well as find my lines, my turn-in points, etc (I use it like a sighting lap). On the warmer days of summer, the time for tire to get up to temp decreases. (I run Power race med front, 2CT rear - and after the first lap at Beave it's giddyup and go!) That said, I have never gotten into a situation where I said to myself "Man, if I had tire warmers, I wouldn't have wasted 14 laps today" or "If I had warmers I wouldn't worry about low-siding in turn X". I've also yet to outride a tire to the point where I had to go to full race tires and warmers because the PPs just weren't cutting it. I'm a mid-pack "I" guy, and it sure as hell ain't the tires or lack or warmers that's keeping me from going faster, or my confidence from climbing. Frankly, I could probably throw on the street Pilot Powers and not worry about it. I might have to pay more attention to what the tires/bike are telling me in terms of feedback and grip, but I doubt if I'd lose any time off my lap average. (These comments exclude the REALLY fast guys - "A" guys, racers, etc).

Its an interesting discussion, and comes up many times each year. I've just never wanted to feel like I had to upgrade tires/warmers to go faster. Hell, I went from a liter-bike to a 600 last year and I went faster on the 6 than on the 1K. My basic point is, I have to have confidence in what I am doing on the bike and what my abilities are. No set of tires or tire warmers are ever going to overcompensate for my lack self-trust or ability.

Here endeth the rant.

excellent post.

 

[Cole]

Should of had that in big bold print about the COLD TRACK
So what if you've got the warmest tires on the first two laps of the day.
You and everyone else are slipping around on the same cold track.

Listen to Marshal (Slossmonster), he's good shit

 

[Drtbkrdude]

Tire Warmers Pros/Cons

I got a pair of Suzuka warmers last year for Moon also.

I ran 11 TD's last year on the same set of DC III's and didn't get the warmers until after 4 TD's. On a warm/hot day it is nice to go out and not worry about tire grip. On cold days however, the track sucked the heat right out of them. I ran Summit Main on 10/24 last year and grip seemed to diminish as the 20 minute session progressed.
IMO warmers will increase tire life by reducing heat cycles and it is nice to begin each session with concentrating only on body position and being smooth rather than also worrying if the tires are going to grip properly at each turn. Cold days are a different story. The cold tear was very noticable on the 24th.
FWW the price of the warmers were less than one set of DCII's.

Brad
I-57
06 GSX-R 750

 

[PJZOCC624]

If warmers give you that much extra confidence, then I'd say go for 'em. Sometimes you need to find confidence in any way you can. (Seriously, not trying to bust balls) I just worry about the rider who has the thought that the baddest ass tire they can buy will make up for lack of ability, or use the tire as an excuse for not knowing what the bike is telling them.

Case in point: I had a nice get-off at Beave in October. My last day of the season, and I felt REALLY good on the GIX. It was a cooler day, and about 3 or 4 laps into the 2nd session, I wadded it up in turn 7. Now, it was still a bit cold (high 50s I think...), and I could've EASILY blamed the crash on cold tires, and I could've convinced myself that it was tires, not ME making the mistake. What happened was I got wide going into 7 and down the hill, and got into some ripples that are out there. I backed off the throttle, loaded the front end, and before I knew what or why, my squash had hit the deck and Zocc and bike were sliding into the sweet bye-and-bye. Did the cold tires contribute to the low side? I dont know, maybe. But I never used that as an excuse for doing the wrong thing at the wrong time.

Man, the Coors Lights are going down easy tonight....