A group rider question
- Thread starter DB_ZX10r
- Start date
rk97
Member
"on a long enough time-line, everyone's survival rate drops to zero." (tyler durden in fight club)
but i think it really depends on the rider. there are guys who go from B to A in one season and are just naturally more comfortable with speed. Then there are the rest of us, who have a bit more fear in us, and hold ourselves back. self preservation?
define "major injury." I would say anything where you can't make a 100% recovery is a major injury, but others might define a major injury as anything that keeps them out of work for more than a day or two.
you can do a lot to ride within your limits, but there will always be others on the track. the possibility for disaster exists at all times - on and off the track. I'd rather be doing something fun when the worst happens, than worrying about what might happen.
friends and loved ones absolutely cringe when i talk about crashes, or how i "almost lost the front in 4th gear," but they know i'd be cranky and bored if i gave up riding. happy and at-risk is better than safe(r) but an a-hole
but i think it really depends on the rider. there are guys who go from B to A in one season and are just naturally more comfortable with speed. Then there are the rest of us, who have a bit more fear in us, and hold ourselves back. self preservation?
define "major injury." I would say anything where you can't make a 100% recovery is a major injury, but others might define a major injury as anything that keeps them out of work for more than a day or two.
you can do a lot to ride within your limits, but there will always be others on the track. the possibility for disaster exists at all times - on and off the track. I'd rather be doing something fun when the worst happens, than worrying about what might happen.
friends and loved ones absolutely cringe when i talk about crashes, or how i "almost lost the front in 4th gear," but they know i'd be cranky and bored if i gave up riding. happy and at-risk is better than safe(r) but an a-hole
JGardy_781
Member
Crashes -
Twice in I - both my fault, both getting overaggressive on cold tires and track; first was a lowside caused by getting too aggressive with the throttle in T9 at Summit Main; second a nasty tankslapper followed by a highside exiting T10 at Summit Main.
Twice in I - both my fault, both getting overaggressive on cold tires and track; first was a lowside caused by getting too aggressive with the throttle in T9 at Summit Main; second a nasty tankslapper followed by a highside exiting T10 at Summit Main.
Knock on wood, no serious injuries thus far (This will be my 6th full year at the track; 7th year since my NESBA intro day), but as people have said, it's not so much if you'll eventually crash, but when - I'd rather roll the dice in a controlled environment, with generous runoff, no oncoming traffic, ambulances available within a few minutes, and (god forbid), helos available for transport you in case you're critical... I'd rather take those odds, than ride hard on the street and be far from home and have something go horribly wrong without all of the carefully devised med support structure.
LesPow
Control Rider
Snikwad,
It was that exact left turn on the South but I lost it on the way in, full throttle as I fell backwards. I hit the ground before I knew it, and the bike fell on its right side first, giving proof that I was pulling the right clip on as I fell off. I tumbled hip to hip, slid on my arse, spun and slammed the back of my head onto the ground, and my first thought was...I am still conscious after all that...I walked away with mixed emotions, anger, laughter, thankfull, and then the corner worker goes, excuse me is this your key? I'm like wow, you even found my key in the grass with out a keyring or anything. Fabulous one less thing to fix.
Then on Jeff. I went to fourth gear going up to turn one which I normally held third. I was also trying to pass my buddy and a combination of that extra shift, missing my normal brake marker, overloaded my brain, I took my eyes out of the turn, and as soon as I saw the tire wall the brain instinctively hit the brakes. Looking back I could have made that turn but it sthese experiences that makes you better or worse.
It was that exact left turn on the South but I lost it on the way in, full throttle as I fell backwards. I hit the ground before I knew it, and the bike fell on its right side first, giving proof that I was pulling the right clip on as I fell off. I tumbled hip to hip, slid on my arse, spun and slammed the back of my head onto the ground, and my first thought was...I am still conscious after all that...I walked away with mixed emotions, anger, laughter, thankfull, and then the corner worker goes, excuse me is this your key? I'm like wow, you even found my key in the grass with out a keyring or anything. Fabulous one less thing to fix.
Then on Jeff. I went to fourth gear going up to turn one which I normally held third. I was also trying to pass my buddy and a combination of that extra shift, missing my normal brake marker, overloaded my brain, I took my eyes out of the turn, and as soon as I saw the tire wall the brain instinctively hit the brakes. Looking back I could have made that turn but it sthese experiences that makes you better or worse.
Stall
New Member
Ya I had a few crashes in my day....
1st My second day on the track ever last year. In
runnin a 
pace 
body positioning (as BigKid tells me cuz he followed me) I was jus runnin with everyone else that was gettin evaulated for a A bump... Anyways turn 12 at HPT chopped the throttle washed out the front. Brand new 08 R1 with street plastics...Doesnt look so pretty now.
2nd Jus last week at HPT in goin into turn one my sidi boots got caught on my rear set couldnt get my boot off of it... Freaked out an pulled it off to set up for the flick an it upset the bike... Pretty bad crash fliped all over pretty much a yard sale for my racebike... An grass wont grow at HPT for years..I was wondering when I was gunna crash again but for a fricken boot problem thats like sayin I had a wardrobe malfunction LOL..
Oh an both were at trackdays.... Bogus should have at least been a raceday.... An my shoulder still hurts from last week...
The END.
1st My second day on the track ever last year. In
runnin a pace body positioning (as BigKid tells me cuz he followed me) I was jus runnin with everyone else that was gettin evaulated for a A bump... Anyways turn 12 at HPT chopped the throttle washed out the front. Brand new 08 R1 with street plastics...Doesnt look so pretty now.2nd Jus last week at HPT in
goin into turn one my sidi boots got caught on my rear set couldnt get my boot off of it... Freaked out an pulled it off to set up for the flick an it upset the bike... Pretty bad crash fliped all over pretty much a yard sale for my racebike... An grass wont grow at HPT for years..I was wondering when I was gunna crash again but for a fricken boot problem thats like sayin I had a wardrobe malfunction LOL..Oh an both were at trackdays.... Bogus should have at least been a raceday.... An my shoulder still hurts from last week...
The END.
DFlowe
New Member
Of these three crashes I wrote about earlier in the post, I've not had any substantial injuries in any of them other than a "bruised ego".
I think you have risk involved in about anything you do. Admittedly, this sport is more dangerous than most; however, I try to do as good as I can within my limitations and not take too many unnecessary risk. The unknown factors are the others around you and I've found that with the possible exception of a few, most of the riders in our A group are safe, confident and skilled riders that want to return home safely, just as you do
Bluenvy
New Member
got bumped to A, next session i highsided turn 9 at summit main after i hit that bump mid turn, destroyed my bike
next TD, highsided in the carousel at beaverun
both times my fault, to heavy on the throttle at to much lean angle. been good for 7 or 8 trackdays since. almost wrecked the other weekend at beaver when i lost the front but managed to save it
next TD, highsided in the carousel at beaverun
both times my fault, to heavy on the throttle at to much lean angle. been good for 7 or 8 trackdays since. almost wrecked the other weekend at beaver when i lost the front but managed to save it
hank
Member
Never crashed, ran off the track a few times - usually not more than a foot or two exiting a bit too wide.
I did run off far into the grass once when a bird pooped all across my visor (seemed like a quart of smelly bird poop at the time) right as I was just turning in on a high speed corner. I couldn't see worth.. well, worth $hit (literally) and managed to keep the bike upright although my feet were hanging off the back of the bike Superman style going though huge moguls (Pocono East)... I was going to bail on the bike, but since I couldn't see what was going on, I had no point of reference to jump off. The next thing I knew I was stopped, still sitting on the bike right in front of the Corner Worker who gave me a thumbs up and waived me onto the track - freaky!
I did run off far into the grass once when a bird pooped all across my visor (seemed like a quart of smelly bird poop at the time) right as I was just turning in on a high speed corner. I couldn't see worth.. well, worth $hit (literally) and managed to keep the bike upright although my feet were hanging off the back of the bike Superman style going though huge moguls (Pocono East)... I was going to bail on the bike, but since I couldn't see what was going on, I had no point of reference to jump off. The next thing I knew I was stopped, still sitting on the bike right in front of the Corner Worker who gave me a thumbs up and waived me onto the track - freaky!
HondaGalToo
Control Rider
You stayed upright going off-roading at Pocono East? :adore:
Thanks guys, lots of good reading. The original question wasn't brought up due to a fear of crashing but more of a curiousity of when most crashes happen, such as which group, or earlier in one's trackday career, etc.
I think the two things that can be taken from those that posted are that probably 99% of all trackday riders, if in the sport for any length of time will most likely experience a crash. And also that probably 95-98% of all crashes are due to rider error. Yes it seems that a trackday crash can be caused mechanically or by someone else taking you out but from the imput it seems most are just STUPID mistakes that we as riders make. Lots of times it seems we survive our mistakes, but many times it seems our mistakes rear their ugly head and bite us.
I think the two things that can be taken from those that posted are that probably 99% of all trackday riders, if in the sport for any length of time will most likely experience a crash. And also that probably 95-98% of all crashes are due to rider error. Yes it seems that a trackday crash can be caused mechanically or by someone else taking you out but from the imput it seems most are just STUPID mistakes that we as riders make. Lots of times it seems we survive our mistakes, but many times it seems our mistakes rear their ugly head and bite us.
crewnutz
Member
everyone wrecks.......although when some people wreck it gets in their head and slows them down
i dont care if i wreck as long as im okay.....i always learn something when i wreck and i come back better than before
a bike can be fixed, always remember that when you wreck and youre okay
most riders/racers that stick with it have a "bad" period in their career where they wreck A LOT
some give up, some slow down, some keep at it and become faster/better riders
i know quite a few very good racers that had one year where they just sucked.......and i mean just wrecked a lot..........but they stuck it out and come back better
oh and i wrecked once...........yesterday in the rain at NJMP paint on a track is like ice, dont ride over it! i was hoping it was FIM level paint (the grippy stuff) but it wasnt
it was my first real wreck since coming back to the track last july after about 1.5 years off
i dont care if i wreck as long as im okay.....i always learn something when i wreck and i come back better than before
a bike can be fixed, always remember that when you wreck and youre okay
most riders/racers that stick with it have a "bad" period in their career where they wreck A LOT
some give up, some slow down, some keep at it and become faster/better riders
i know quite a few very good racers that had one year where they just sucked.......and i mean just wrecked a lot..........but they stuck it out and come back better
oh and i wrecked once...........yesterday in the rain at NJMP
paint on a track is like ice, dont ride over it! i was hoping it was FIM level paint (the grippy stuff) but it wasntit was my first real wreck since coming back to the track last july after about 1.5 years off
greytop
New Member
45 days in NESBA - 0 Crashes
7 in B Group
16 in I group
22 in A Group (1 run off at BeaveRun, kept it up)
3 Days at Jennings GP - 0 Crashes (1 run off in the kink. kept it up)
2 Days NY Sportbike Club - 0 Crashes
2 Days TPM - 0 Crashes
4 Days Roger Lyle - 0 Crashes
1 Day STT - Crashed in Turn 8 at JC, broke finger and continued to ride - was totally my fault riding over my head and with no reserve
TOTAL - 57 Days, 2 runoffs, 1 crash, 1 broken finger
Now I constantly ride in my "comfort zone" which happens to be, at most days, a mid to rear pack Nesba A pace or a mid to front of the pack at other orgs "fast" group. The only thing I feel is out of my control is what other riders do. But, for the most part, at a Nesba day, I feel completely comfortable with the other A group riders; all those that are are faster and the few that are slower.
7 in B Group
16 in I group
22 in A Group (1 run off at BeaveRun, kept it up)
3 Days at Jennings GP - 0 Crashes (1 run off in the kink. kept it up)
2 Days NY Sportbike Club - 0 Crashes
2 Days TPM - 0 Crashes
4 Days Roger Lyle - 0 Crashes
1 Day STT - Crashed in Turn 8 at JC, broke finger and continued to ride - was totally my fault riding over my head and with no reserve
TOTAL - 57 Days, 2 runoffs, 1 crash, 1 broken finger
Now I constantly ride in my "comfort zone" which happens to be, at most days, a mid to rear pack Nesba A pace or a mid to front of the pack at other orgs "fast" group. The only thing I feel is out of my control is what other riders do. But, for the most part, at a Nesba day, I feel completely comfortable with the other A group riders; all those that are are faster and the few that are slower.
chaun
New Member
1st Crash - 2nd trackday - Instructor with another org suggested I run 34 psi in the rear on my R6, tire spinned up and I lowsided on the exit... tire was cold. Should have had 28 psi. Lesson learned.
2nd thru 30th Crash - Riding mini bikes with the Oklahoma Superbikers. Those little suckers are hard to stay on.
31st Crash - A Group (another org) - Ran bike off track, misjudged run off. Head... meet tire wall.
All my fault except the 1st one...
It's gonna happen. Question is... will you get back on the bike?
2nd thru 30th Crash - Riding mini bikes with the Oklahoma Superbikers. Those little suckers are hard to stay on.
31st Crash - A Group (another org) - Ran bike off track, misjudged run off. Head... meet tire wall.
All my fault except the 1st one...
It's gonna happen. Question is... will you get back on the bike?
dlockhart5x
New Member
Crashed at (some multiple times, sorta lost track)
Autobahn (rain)
Barber (punted off by my brother)
Blackhawk (rain X2)
Gingerman (coolant leak )
Grattan (over enthusisatic over the jump)
HPT ???
MAM (heat/ blackout,. fell over)
Putnam ?? a few times
Road America (rain)
The tracks I have ridden and not crashed at
Nelson Ledges
Iowa Speedway
Autobahn (rain)
Barber (punted off by my brother)
Blackhawk (rain X2)
Gingerman (coolant leak )
Grattan (over enthusisatic over the jump)
HPT ???
MAM (heat/ blackout,. fell over)
Putnam ?? a few times
Road America (rain)
The tracks I have ridden and not crashed at
Nelson Ledges
Iowa Speedway
justariot66
New Member
Crashed at pocono 2 times, once was on an r6 and put it in a gear lower than I should have coming off the back straight. I let out the clutch quick (noob) and locked the rear and it chucked me over the front.
2nd time I was railing on my new at the time gsxr750 and came into one and ran up on someone goiing far to slow. I looked through the turn and just kept leaning trying to go under him without ramming him too much lean too much speed and tucked the front.
I have learned a tremendous amount about control and comfort, oh and i have learned to control my closing speeds on slower riders as we near a turn (some what anyway).
dave #66
2nd time I was railing on my new at the time gsxr750 and came into one and ran up on someone goiing far to slow. I looked through the turn and just kept leaning trying to go under him without ramming him too much lean too much speed and tucked the front.
I have learned a tremendous amount about control and comfort, oh and i have learned to control my closing speeds on slower riders as we near a turn (some what anyway).
dave #66
