Safety award system?

[boxertwin]

I used to work for a company that implemented a zero accident safety program. While it was tough to get off the ground and even more difficult to maintain, after a couple of years it really began to pay off as accidents plummeted and people began to gain a sense of pride in an accident free record. While we had a small pay incentive in the system, the real motivator came down to award stickers on our hardhats. If you joined a crew where everyone had a 5 year safety award sticker on their hardhat, you knew you'd better keep your stuff wired tight that day or someone was going to be on your a$$. Likewise, if you showed up with a five year sticker, all the guys around you knew you would have their back and you could be relied upon to make sound decisions. If there was an accident during the workday, the whole crew took the hit and everyone got reset back to the start.

Given the pride and recognition of the NESBA bump and it's associated stickers, I wonder if a similar recognition system couldn't be put in place to encourage safety oriented decision making. I for one, would be proud to sport a 5 day/10 day/20 day series of stickers on my bike or helmet showing that I'm committed to safe riding and less red flags. The criteria would be fairly simple to establish: Something like your bar end hits the ground, you reset back to the start regardless of fault or blame. The implementation, on the other hand, I'm not so sure about (could it be integrated into the membership software?).

Every rider meeting I've attended has basically stated that we only "win" trackdays by bringing bike and body home the same way we started (less some fuel, rubber, and lap time ) and I completely agree with that. It'd be cool, though, if some of the people who are out there riding safely and making good decisions were recognized for their efforts. I'm thinking a B or I rider that gets awarded a 20 day safety sticker is going to feel about as good as the guy that gets an A bump that day.....a point of pride that everyone can display to show they are committed to safe riding. A brief recognition at the morning riders meeting, would certainly be a "win" for the recipients that day.

Just some thoughts because I've seen it work first hand. I certainly don't want to make more work for the NESBA admins, but maybe in the long run, it'd solve more problems than are caused. As a noob I'm hesitant to make any suggestion to the organization, but I'll close by offering my help any way I can if someone thinks it's a good idea.

 

[HondaGalToo]

Not a bad idea, I like it. Not sure how they'd implement it, but hopefully more good chatter will start up in here. A sticker, or maybe a recognition on the board, or maybe a coupon for a few bucks to the trackday store?

 

[PJZOCC624]

Good thought. I think this has some potential. I like the helmet/bike sticker idea (kinda like college football helmet stickers!), and a NESBA/TrackdayStore credit award system might be nice. Doesn't have to be much - 10 credits for X # of accident free rides.

Although, Im pretty sure the majority of us don't need an incentive to not wad ourselves up on the track, I do like the idea of recognizing safety and consistency.

 

[avizpls]

I cant think of a way to really make it work, though I like the idea. Not crashing is something we will all try to do on our own. The safety and good decisions need to be observed by the CRs. too difficult to watch everyone all the time. There would be numerous false positives.

 

[jcrich]

PJZOCC17;141855 wrote: Good thought. I think this has some potential. I like the helmet/bike sticker idea (kinda like college football helmet stickers!), and a NESBA/TrackdayStore credit award system might be nice. Doesn't have to be much - 10 credits for X # of accident free rides.

Although, Im pretty sure the majority of us don't need an incentive to not wad ourselves up on the track, I do like the idea of recognizing safety and consistency.

So you want stickers and a discount for doing something that you should be doing anyhow?
Who would administer something like this? Who determines what was a "safe" crash or an "unsafe" crash? Way too many moving parts here.

As you say in your 2nd statement, you should need no incentive to follow the rules and ride within them and be as safe as you possibly can.

 

[HondaGalToo]

jcrich;141889 wrote: So you want stickers and a discount for doing something that you should be doing anyhow?
Who would administer something like this? Who determines what was a "safe" crash or an "unsafe" crash? Way too many moving parts here.

As you say in your 2nd statement, you should need no incentive to follow the rules and ride within them and be as safe as you possibly can.

I think the idea would be for NO crashes, not a "safe" crash. However, you're right, we should all be riding safely and trying not to crash, as it's a trackday. However, there always seems to be a few with the racing mindset at trackdays. And, it's possible that all the incentives in the world won't change the few incorrect mindsets.

I still don't think it's a bad idea....but yeah, the implementation may be too difficult.

 

[barry38]

Why tempt fate? You know soon as you put a "haven't crashed in X days" sticker on your bike, you will crash right??????

 

[beac83]

I like the concept of promoting safer riding.

That said, I don't know how such a sticker program would be administered by our volunteer staff. That's a lot of paperwork to add on.

Every NESBA trackday I attend, the Riders meeting stresses that it's a Track Day, not a Race, and that the only way to "win" is to go home grinning, tired and with the bike shiny.

But every track day, someone gets too over-confident or too aggressive, or both, and crashes.

Or they haven't been paying attention to their equipment (bike, tires, etc) or have an unpredictable mechanical failure, and crash.

Or they are neither over-aggressive nor over-confident, but in riding and learning manage to put themselves in situations that they don't yet have the skills to handle, and crash.

Or something on the track - animal, vegetable, or mineral - creates a hazard and leads someone to crash.

These 4 broad categories cover most on-track crashes. While the first two should be minimized and/or eliminated, the first is ego-driven, and thus requires personal restraint to control. The second is mostly a training and attention to detail issue. The third is, to some extent, a by product of learning. We all try not to do this, but it does happen. The fourth is totally random (except for the hazard of other rider's mistakes) and is very difficult to eliminate.

We are all out there learning to improve our skills. For most of us, sooner or later we will make a mistake that will cause an off.

The key to preventing crashes is to ride within your own limits and with consideration for the others out there with you on track, while pushing to improve your skill sets.

I hear this request from the Directors and CR's at every riders meeting. But a few people at each day seem to think it only applies to others. I know the CR's prefer to teach and not police. But they will police if necessary. If you see a rider being dangerous, tell a CR about it.

I don't think all crashes can be eliminated, but I think that we, as a group, can do better than we currently are at minimizing the risks to ourselves and others. Improvements are an individual accomplishment, but running a safer track day is a group activity and a responsibility of all members.

If you see a rider being dangerous, speak with him/her or call it to the attention of a CR. We are a membership organization, and its up to us to set/maintain the organizational standards and ethics when it comes to on-track behavior. We as a group can set a standard and practice that will tend to minimize the first three categories of crashes.

 

[jcrich]

barry38;141908 wrote: Why tempt fate? You know soon as you put a "haven't crashed in X days" sticker on your bike, you will crash right??????

Exactly!!!! Just like getting new leathers or getting new paint.

 

[Meat]

I am also of the opinion that a rider that rides to be safer for himself/herself/itself may not actually be safer for everyone around them.

As we all try not to crash, being fearful of it will often cause a crash just as I think too much focus on it at the track will also cause a crash. We should be focused on riding not on not-crashing.

 

[HondaGalToo]

barry38;141908 wrote: why tempt fate? You know soon as you put a "haven't crashed in x days" sticker on your bike, you will crash right??????

rotflmao

 

[boxertwin]

Cool input, everyone. Thanks for your thoughts.

I think all the hard work that everyone in this org has done to promote safe riding is a great thing. Those that have been at it long before I ever thought of turning a wheel on the track have my respect and gratitude for establishing a program second to none and I certainly intend on doing my best to carry those values in everything I do out there.

My thoughts had more to do with recognition than any monetary incentives. In my experience the money factor only accounts for 10% of the motivation, the other 90% has it's roots in pride and achievement. The program I spoke of simply sought to assign a quantity to the term "safety", measure that quantity, attempt to improve it at all times, and recognize those that were achieving their goals. I'm involved in a fairly high risk occupation (tree climber) and many in the business didn't think there was much to be done about the inherent risk. In the end, things like a formal accident reporting system, post incident peer review, and a system of recognition made the tree industry a much safer way to make a living. We really didn't need someone to tell us that getting hurt is a bad thing, but until we started measuring, analyzing, and picking apart what was going wrong, it was difficult for everyone to work towards a common goal.

Given the pride everyone takes in the bump, it seemed to me that the foundation was already there for a recognition system that would give the motivation to always have safety front and center above all else.

Again, just some thoughts.....never hurts to have a discussion on making things safer for everyone

 

[beac83]

Chris,

Thanks for your posts. Anything we can work out as a club to lower the number of crashes is valuable. You have stimulated thought, and folks throughout the club monitor and digest the posts here.

Your thoughts are always welcome.

 

[PJZOCC624]

jcrich;141889 wrote: So you want stickers and a discount for doing something that you should be doing anyhow?
Who would administer something like this? Who determines what was a "safe" crash or an "unsafe" crash? Way too many moving parts here.

As you say in your 2nd statement, you should need no incentive to follow the rules and ride within them and be as safe as you possibly can.

Nope, didn't say I want sticker and a discount for doing something I should be doing, I said I like the idea of recognizing safety and consistency.

Never said anything about a "safe" crash or "unsafe" crash.

I don't need the incentive, and I follow the rules and do ride safely and courteously. Looking back over my 6 years since I've joined NESBA, I've only had ONE crash, a low side at Beaverun in Sept '08. Before that, I'd have to go back to Texas Motorsports Ranch back in '01 when I had my 748. So, two crashes in the past 9 years - neither which sent me to the ER or had my bike out of comission for more than a couple hours - is a pretty solid record. Anyone who knows me or has ridden with me could probably attest to the fact that I always ride safely and within the rules.

I guess I thought the idea of a MEMBERS FEEDBACK forum was to make suggestions for improvements to OUR club, and maybe to brainstorm some new ideas amongst ourselves. You don't like the idea? That's fine. Criticize the idea or suggestion, but don't for a second think you can make a judgement about me or my riding if you've never ridden with me before. Shit like that irritates the fuck out of me.

 

[PJZOCC624]

barry38;141908 wrote: Why tempt fate? You know soon as you put a "haven't crashed in X days" sticker on your bike, you will crash right??????

Maybe the most intelligent counterpoint to this whole discussion, Barry!

But, I thought the only certainy to crashing was a new paint job or new set of leathers? :dunno: Except now that I've laid out my history, I've completely doomed myself. :doh: Time to duct tape a St Christopher medal to my upper triple....

 

[slowpoke]

I just think it's cool seeing NESBians brainstorming about safety, and as I read the thread I see HondaGaltoo who has an amazing record when it comes to years on track vs crashes and now I see your impressive stats as well PJ. Stuff like that impresses me so much more than any laptime or trophy:adore:

 

[HondaGalToo]

PJ, nice record. Should I say, nice track record? LOL. Thanks for the kudos, slowpoke! Still liking this idea, but it could be kept simple, even just a spot on the forum for a bit of recognition. Nothing fancy, no monetary incentive.

 

[PJZOCC624]

Judy's one of those riders out there that I really enjoy riding with. She's super consistent, predicatable, and I'm totally comfortable being "bar to bar" with her in the corners (never THAT close, of course). I know when she comes around me or I come around her that shes gonna hold her line and not be spooked or take my front wheel out. Makes it all that much more fun out there!

 

[Mr.DJ]

slowpoke;142091 wrote: I just think it's cool seeing NESBians brainstorming about safety

:agree:

 

[jcrich]

PJZOCC17;142089 wrote: Nope, didn't say I want sticker and a discount for doing something I should be doing, I said I like the idea of recognizing safety and consistency.

Never said anything about a "safe" crash or "unsafe" crash.

I don't need the incentive, and I follow the rules and do ride safely and courteously. Looking back over my 6 years since I've joined NESBA, I've only had ONE crash, a low side at Beaverun in Sept '08. Before that, I'd have to go back to Texas Motorsports Ranch back in '01 when I had my 748. So, two crashes in the past 9 years - neither which sent me to the ER or had my bike out of comission for more than a couple hours - is a pretty solid record. Anyone who knows me or has ridden with me could probably attest to the fact that I always ride safely and within the rules.

I guess I thought the idea of a MEMBERS FEEDBACK forum was to make suggestions for improvements to OUR club, and maybe to brainstorm some new ideas amongst ourselves. You don't like the idea? That's fine. Criticize the idea or suggestion, but don't for a second think you can make a judgement about me or my riding if you've never ridden with me before. Shit like that irritates the fuck out of me.

Please point out in my post were I made any specific comment singling out your riding ability, your actions on the track, or how you conduct yourself at the track

What pisses me off is people's lack of reading comprehension.