SV650 clearance help Exhaust/Rear Sets

[Quantum_Ape]

So i searched the forum but i guess it's still too new to have information on this already.

I was hopping someone out there could lend some advice on clearance issues. I have an 06 SV650S and would like to increase the lean angle the bike is capable of a bit. I find myself dragging feelers and worrying my huge stock exhaust is going to lowside me.

I would also like to note that the clearance issues isn't because I'm not getting off the bike. I will always be improving form, but I'm currently off and dragging puck, trying to reduce the lean angle of the bike as much as i can.

Right now the bike is pretty much stock. I am looking at getting a high mount exhaust and rear sets to allow more clearance on the bike. I had the Holeshot highmount slipon in mind and i haven't found a rearset yet. I like the Holeshot because it allows me to keep my rear passenger pegs, is out of the way, and it looks nice. I'm not looking for a power increase from swapping the exhaust so i figure a slip on will do the trick. This is still a street/track bike and i would like to take my wife out for rides once in a while so the rear pegs are important. I'm torn between two issues with the rearset. I like the idea of a peg that flexes, thus preventing a lowside from grinding a solid peg, like the stock ones do. The problem is i want to bring the rear sets higher up and all the after market sets have stiff pegs. I'm currently contemplating making a mount that would allow me to raise the stock mounts and get grippier pegs to bolt on.

Does anyone have any insight they would like to share? I would greatly appreciate it.

 

[track4me]

I have an '06 SV650S and was draggin those peg feeler things in T10 at beaver and I was dragging the kickstand nub feeler (that you can grab with your foot to help put the kickstand down with) in T1 at beave. I took off the peg feelers and I cut off the kickstand feeler. i was not having any problems after that.

BUT.... just to make sure I got some Vortex adjustable rearsets and M4 highmount pipe. My rearsets and pipe both allow me to use the passenger pegs if needed.

 

[Quantum_Ape]

Thanks for the info! The M4 was another consideration of mine but i didn't have enough details on it to be sure. I noticed in some of my photo's my kickstand was getting nice and low as well.

How do you like your vortex rear sets? My brother has them and we think they contributed to his lowside on the 19th at Summit Point JC. His bike was low enough to drag the peg at its highest setting which ended in a smooth slide off the turn. Thats why i was thinking about something that would give me a little more warning and feel. Better body positioning later that weekend solved the issue, but because of the stiff peg, there was no warning before the lowside.

 

[track4me]

Quantum_Ape;2944 wrote:
How do you like your vortex rear sets? My brother has them and we think they contributed to his lowside on the 19th at Summit Point JC. His bike was low enough to drag the peg at its highest setting which ended in a smooth slide off the turn. Thats why i was thinking about something that would give me a little more warning and feel. Better body positioning later that weekend solved the issue, but because of the stiff peg, there was no warning before the lowside.

I love the rearsets, I run them in GP shift and at the 2nd to lowest setting since I am 6'1. I sometimes drag a toe and then I know its time to hang off more or slow it down.

 

[Tony A]

There is a fellow on ebay that makes the riser plts for the stock pegs. search sv650 you should find them.

 

[JGardy_781]

Woodcraft rearset brackets (at least the ones on my older SV) allow you to use pretty much any stock-replacement type of footpeg with them, so if you want to replace the rigid pegs with folders, you could. If clearance with rearsets carrying solid pegs becomes a problem (I'm a fan of solid pegs, personally), I'd humbly suggest that it might be time to fit a taller rear shock to raise rear ride height some, too. If you're riding hard enough to drag hard parts on an SV, you're probably overriding the stock shock...

As for can clearance, I crashed my SV a few times, enough to bend the low-mount M4 in some which handily created a bunch of extra clearance... I'd advise against this method though - the results are too unpredictable!

 

[JGardy_781]

Oh - since the forum's so shiny and new, you can head over to the old forum to see if anything's there that would help you... There's a link at the bottom of each page that says "Old Forum (Read-Only)" in a blue background right above the Yamaha logo... click and back to the old BBS you go...

 

[SimplyRed]

Tony A;2981 wrote: There is a fellow on ebay that makes the riser plts for the stock pegs. search sv650 you should find them.

This is a good, inexpensive approach. I bought a set from a guy for my SV650 a few years ago, then replaced my stock pegs with Woodcraft pegs. If you have the ability to make them yourself, even cheaper.

 

[SimplyRed]

Another thing that will help is an aftermarket shock (e.g. Penske) that has ride height adjustment. In conjunction with proper fork adjustments, the rear will ride a bit higher, thus increasing clearance. Of course, the handling will be better too with the upgraded suspension.

 

[Quantum_Ape]

Thanks everyone! Track, my bro runs GP as well. After taking a trip on his bike I decided i would switch to GP just as soon as i have some time to get used to it before the next track day. Definitely better for shifting out of turns!

Tony, i will definitely check out ebay and look for the rear sets.

JGardy, I will check out woodcraft as well. I like the idea of having the option to pick either hard or folders. You also made a very good point. I am still running stock suspension and with my 180 pound self there is a very good chance i need to upgrade with the level that i am now riding at. The stock shocks only have preload adjustment and it's as high as i can set it without adverse affects on handling. Thanks, i didn't even think about raising the rear! As i don't have much experience with this, do you have any suggestions on how much the rear should/can be raised without adverse effects?

And yes, i hear only the really cool guys are able to preform this clearance procedure on there exhaust. Several people have walked away with less than optimal results. I am glad to hear yours turned out favorable

I also had no idea the old forum was still up to be read. I will have search there in the future too! Guess i need to get more familiar with how things work on this site

 

[Quantum_Ape]

Thanks SimplyRed, you snuck in there and posted while i was writing my response to everyone, didn't mean to leave you out

Adjustable ride hight would definitely be a plus in a new suspension set up. The more i can adjust, the more i can learn and hopefully set up the bike to my specific needs. Plus i get to throw around cool words like bound and rebound dampening, preload, and ride hight like i know what i'm talking about.

But really, i would love to learn much more than i do now about suspension theory and actually have something i can fully adjust to apply what i learn.

Any recommendations for a good replacement? I will check out Penske since you mentioned them.

Thanks!

 

[chikn munky]

Also keep in mind, if you get a high mount exhaust you may have clearance issues with you're right side turn signal.

 

[JGardy_781]

SV's (at least first gens; probably second gens too) were sprung closer to a 130 lb rider than a 180 lb rider for the racetrack... A good ride height for an SV is much higher in the rear than stock, but needs to be accompanied by a steering damper (I found this out firsthand myself in T10 at Summit Main). Anyway, To get the right spring and shock length for your weight and riding style, you'll need to go aftermarket for a shock...

Why can't you just fix the stock shock? Even if you could yank off the stock shock, pull the spring, and install a new heaver weight spring, you'd now have a shock whose damping was woefully inadequate to control the energy stored and released by the heaver spring. Walk into GMD, Speedwerks, Traxxion, T suspensions, etc. with a stock SV shock and ask for a revalve to get the damping right, and I bet you'd get a hell of a laugh, but no work on your OEM shock (1st gen OEM shocks make excellent paperweights, but little else; I bet the 2nd gen shocks aren't much better). For arguments sake, if they could change the damping, you'd still have no external control of the damping circuits, and you would be stuck with the stock length of the shock wioth no way to alter ride height (first gens don't have the ability to alter ride height via shims like some other bikes; second gens are probably similar). So, then to alter ride height, you'd need to alter the linkage that the shock, frame and swingarm mount to. Changing the link lengths alters leverage ratios between the swingarm and shock, which can either make the shock feel harder or less hard in variable parts of the swingarm's travel. Not necessarily bad, but not necessarily good.

Or, you buy a decent aftermarket shock, and have one of the aforementioned knowledgeable vendors have it sprung, the preload approximated for your weight, and damping and the body length of the shock set by the pros for your weight and bike. Costs a little bit of coin for a penske double, elka, ohlins, etc., but it makes an f'in world of difference in how the bike feels and how much confidence you can derive from it. Note that with a change to the rear suspension, you should alter the internals of the fork to get a good spring and matched damping rates, along with appropriate preload for your weight. With the damping rod forks in SVs, this is accomplished via a Racetech cartridge fork emulator (and some associated modifications to the damping rods), heavier springs, and heavier weight oil. SVRider.com is an excellent resource for all this stuff; probably better than here because it's entirely SV focused.

I rode a 636 shock on my 1st gen SV for years with a emulator'ed front end to halfway decent pace (58's at JC), and I will say that going to properly set up suspension on another bike made a world of difference in feel and control of the bike...

Longwinded post DONE.

 

[JGardy_781]

Instead of being a wiseass, why don't I just answer your questions...

Quantum_Ape;3026 wrote: do you have any suggestions on how much the rear should/can be raised without adverse effects?
Can't remember, but it's quite a bit over stock. A good suspension vendor can get you pointed in the right direction, as can some of the guys who poke around here who've raced SVs... my SV was up quite a bit at the back, and down quite a bit at the front before I hit real substantial instability "issues" (euphamism for tankslapping highside out of T10 on summit main).

Quantum_Ape;3026 wrote:
And yes, i hear only the really cool guys are able to preform this clearance procedure on there exhaust. Several people have walked away with less than optimal results. I am glad to hear yours turned out favorable

Note that with this procedure, results are NOT repeatable, and believe me, you won't feel "cool" watching your bike bounce along behind you as you coast to a stop. However, your buddies WILL laugh their a$$es off at you since just before you leave for your session, you make a comment like "...It's been years since I've crashed...", or if your bike starts creating a james-bond like smokescreen after it's just dropped a half quart of oil into its airbox through the crank breathers after aforementioned tankslapping highside... Comic relief - guaranteed!

 

[Quantum_Ape]

JGardy, i thought you did a great job answering me with the first post. LOTS of great info!

From what i know of the stock second gen shock, you're in the same boat you are with the first. May be some differences between them but a replacement shock definitely seems the way to go. I'm glad you mention a steering damper! Actually I've already felt some shake trying to (feudally) keep up with those 600 super sports and liter bikes on the straits. Seems like the sudden unloading of the suspension between shifts disrupts the bike. But i digress.

I think my game plan right now is to find an after market rear suspension setup and to rework the front forks. That will be my first priority.

There after, i will look for a high mount and rear sets and by that point, if i use stiff pegs, and they are scraping, by all rights i should already be eating grass already and it wont matter with the bike being higher and having more clearance overall. Also i hear they give you a bit better feed back and feel much more stable then the foldable ones.


chikn munky, thanks for mentioning that. I did notice a reminder on Holeshots websight about the high mounts and turn signals. Luckily i already took care of the rear turn signals. I reworked the LED array in my tail light to be both the brake light and turn signal. So luckily i won't have to worry about that.

This is some very awesome information guys! Everyone has far exceeded my expectations here. I'm pretty new to nesba and I'm wishing i had joined up earlier. At every turn i have found nothing but helpful, nice, and great people. Both at the track and on the forums. This is a great group and i really do appreciate it! I nearly gave up even bothering with forums from my past experiences.

Looks like I'm going to be addicted to my computer once again :adore:

 

[SimplyRed]

Quantum_Ape;3030 wrote: Thanks SimplyRed, you snuck in there and posted while i was writing my response to everyone, didn't mean to leave you out

Adjustable ride hight would definitely be a plus in a new suspension set up. The more i can adjust, the more i can learn and hopefully set up the bike to my specific needs. Plus i get to throw around cool words like bound and rebound dampening, preload, and ride hight like i know what i'm talking about.

But really, i would love to learn much more than i do now about suspension theory and actually have something i can fully adjust to apply what i learn.

Any recommendations for a good replacement? I will check out Penske since you mentioned them.

Thanks!

JGardy hit all the key points - the stock suspension stinks, LOL. Penske double-clicker (model 8981) is an excellent shock and is commonly used on the SV as well as other bikes. This means you can prob find one used as well as get good setup advice & support from a shop, trackday suspension vendors, and other knowledgeable riders. Check svrider.com as previously mentioned as well as the WERA racer's forum (www.wera.com) classifieds.

 

[SimplyRed]

Also, if you decide to go the used Penske route, you don't necessarily need one off of an SV since you can send it to Penske in Reading, PA to get refitted for any bike (for ~$100 I think). Penske contact e-mail: info@penske.com, Phone: 610-375-6180.

 

[JGardy_781]

Quantum_Ape;3070 wrote: I'm glad you mention a steering damper! Actually I've already felt some shake trying to (feudally) keep up with those 600 super sports and liter bikes on the straits. Seems like the sudden unloading of the suspension between shifts disrupts the bike. But i digress.

You'll get some instability worked into the chassis as you shift - that's sort of natural as the near fully rearward weight bias under accelleration suddenly shifts forward as you grab a gear, and back again as you get on the throttle, especially if the bike isn't perfectly straight up and down through that that weight transfer... even with a damper, you'll still get a wiggle as you're accellerating hard in that scenario (I see it through the kink in the back straight every time I shift). What I'm talking about with the damper is if you accellerate out of a corner, and you get a bit of a front wobble from the bars that seems to grow in amplitude and frequency as you carry it - it's usually more sustained than the wiggle through the kink at JC - the wiggle in 2 is maybe 2 or 3 cycles or so of the bars and it stops quickly and doesn't get more violent as you carry it.

The thing to look out for is when the oscillation of the bars grows faster in that type of situation, and occurs for a maybe half-dozen oscillations or more and then manages to subside - guys that have been doing this longer than I may chime in, but that's the bike telling you something - that you're on the edge of the bike throwing itself into a full-on tankslapper... that's when you know you should have already installed a steering damper.

I unfortunately wasn't listening well to the bike and learned the hard way that all those little slappers were the bike telling me that something bigger was coming.

 

[Folly1]

I put 5000 track miles on an 05 SV. Great bike. I am sure that you are over-riding the stock shock. One from an 06 GSXR750 will probably fit and will be cheap on e-bay. A big upgrade. Check svrider website. for details on the swap. It might be an 05. A penske double will also be a big up-grade.
Put in a cartridge emulator in the forks with the correct weight springs and oiland you will not believe the difference. Check the race tech wedsite. They or Traxxon have a spring weight calculator.

We can help you spend your money!!

My SV RAILED through turns after those upgrades. I still have not gotten either of 2 other bikes to track like it did.

Ben.

 

[track4me]

SimplyRed;3132 wrote: Check svrider.com as previously mentioned as well as the WERA racer's forum (www.wera.com) classifieds.

WERA board is where I found my Ohlins shock!